Lord knows I love me some Brother President. But I have lost patience with him when it comes to his trying to negotiate with Republicans.
Facts:
#1 290 bills passed by the House are sitting in the Senate because Republican Senators refuse to vote on them
#2 The Gop is misusing filibusters to hold up legislations (they have “spiked”) since Obama took office
#3 Democrats have allowed the GOP to chip away at Obama’s health care plan (killing the public option) and haven’t gotten a damn thing for it.
#4 Obama’s health care would save billions over a ten year period and create jobs.
Its time for President Obama to scrap bi-partisanship and the Democrats to call for up or down (majority) votes. In other words reconcilliation.
Don’t take my word watch MSNBC. Sisters and Brothers what say you?
The Immortal Saga
Collision of Worlds 
Uuummmmmm, up until the election of Scott Brown, the Dems had just about a year to ram through *ANYTHING* they wanted to. The GOP didn’t have the numbers to stop any of it. Don’t blame the GOP for this. It was the DNC who couldn’t pass the agenda at hand.
At this point, let the Dems try reconciliation. It will completely screw their chances of getting re-elected anytime soon.
I take you earn over $250,000 and have a “cadillac” health insurance plan. Because if you don’t fit into both the above categories you shouldn’t be voting Republican.
President Obama wants to roll back the tax breaks for the top earners Bush put in and raise taxes on all those making $250,000 or above; in addition to providing health care for all uninsured Americans and imposing regulations on Health Insurance companies that are squeezing Americans like a lemon. In Calif (only one example) they had 39% increase on their premimums.
Why anyone would vote Republican unless they’re rich is mind boggling. They don’t care if we have jobs, if we’re losing our homes, if we have health insurance. They don’t care. People are dying — literally dying– because they’re uninsured or their insurance refuses to pay for the treatments they need. And the GOP doesn’t care. They don’t care. Period.
Anyone that’s voting for them that isn’t rich, and has a counscience should look at where they stand on the issues and then research those issues using another source besides Rush Limbaugh or Fox News. Either that or find a good therapist and explore why you enjoy being abused. Peace.
Good Lord Immortal, you’re listening to all of the rhetoric about class envy and the demonization of success. The fact that you automatically assigned me to that “evil” group makes me wonder how much critical thought you’ve put into the matter.
I don’t fall into the category you’ve referred to, yet still I’m a victim of Obama’s utopian vision of big government for all. Most of us working Americans across the income spectrum are, and they’re because of his policies.
If Obama really wanted to insure the uninsured and drive down health costs, he would advocate measures like tort reform and allowing the populace to cross state lines to buy insurance.
Even beyond that, if he were not to advocate such policies (he won’t), he could put together a package to insure the uninsured using unspent Porkulus funds. He won’t do that either, because the notion of insuring Americans for their health coverage has never been the big picture goal. Putting the American people under the Government thumb has been the real machination all along.
I’m not buying into class envy, and I don’t believe that this is the sentiment driving HC reform. But just for the record, the wealthy didn’t make their money by themselves — they made it because someone bought something, worked for them or they outsourced somebody’s job etc. (Doesn’t it ever give you pause that when you call Customer Service lines you often get India? But that’s another dicussion).
The rich are just as responsible for paying taxes as the rest of us hard working stiffs. If I made $250,000 a year I wouldn’t give a rat’s a** if my taxes went up.
Asking folks to pay their fair share isn’t envy. This is not pre-colonial England. This is America where everyone has a right to a decent wage, housing and health care.
Furthermore, tort reform would only reduce HC costs by 1%. That’s not even a drop in the bucket to the billions that Health Insurance companies are raking in. Crossing state lines to the same companies isn’t going to drive down costs either.
Finally, the American people want Health Care reform. The only ones concerned about “big brother” are the Insurance Companies because they don’t want competition. Cry me a river. Excuse me but isn’t competition one of the basis of a free market system?
Oh, and as far as us being victimzied by the Obama administration we just narrowly avoided another Great Depression. We got in this mess to begin with based upon Bushnomics, not Obama. And more than a few GOP governors, while whining in public about the stimulus package, requested large sums of it for their states.
I’d like to see study that justifies that tort reform would only reduce costs by 1%. Regardless, I’ll take the 1% drop over the astronomical increases that a government run system will provide.
The fair share progressive tax code is a sham too. You make the comment that if you were making that much, you wouldn’t mind Uncle Sam dipping deeper in your pocket. That’s the mantra of the class envy crowd.
As far as the free market is concerned, don’t you think that having a wider variety of plans to shop nationwide versus the handful you find in a given state better for reducing prices?
Americans don’t want health care reform. They want reform for the cost of health care. Big difference. The things government can run efficiently can probably be counted on one hand. What makes you think they could run it better than private industry?
Another Great Depression? Doubtful. Bushnomics? Be careful about that, because there was contributory negligence on the part of the Dems. But that’s also another conversation as well.
Good luck with reconciliation. It will kill the DNC as you know it.
Wanting each individual to pay his share of taxes isn’t class envy, it’s just fair. As your income increases so should your taxes. Do you know that under the current tax laws you can get a tax break for buying a football team?
Futhermore the “wide variety of plans” you speak of is a mirage. A small number of conglomerants own all of the insurance companies in America (e.g. Blue Cross Blue Shield). Which is why insurance lobbyists are trying to kill national health care. And why crossing state lines won’t work.
And before you make a blanket assumption as to what you think Americans want check your research. Check the public opinion polls. Check too how many Americans have died just within the last 6 months because of no insurance, or insurance that wouldn’t cover them.
Also Clinton came into office we had a defict. When he left office we had a suplus which Bush promply ran through and created another defict. The economic problems we’re experiencing are a result of him — and the GOP — running the US treasury like it was their own private piggy bank.
Oh and news flash: Your boy Scott Brown is voting with us and the GOP is hopping mad about it.We’ll see if reconcilliation works. Any movement is an improvement over standing still.
Valjeanne, you’re inspiring me to write a blog about the evils of progressive taxation. I appreciate that.
Back to health care.
Two questions, one has already been asked.
1. What makes you think a government run plan could be more efficient and cost effective than those run by private industry, while at the same time providing a quality level of service that isn’t littered with long wait periods for the simplest of procedures, rationing, etc.?
2. If the concern to get UHC into place is so great because people are dying without it, than why didn’t the Congressional Dems get the package through last July when Obama first requested it? They had the votes to do it. For that matter, why don’t they just spend unspent stimulus funds to git-r-done?
TharpSter:
1. What makes you think the US government wouldn’t do a better job than a healthcare system that denies treatment to folks because it’s too expensive or “experimental” — that literally leaves our uninsured to die? What makes you think our government wouldn’t do better than a HC system that’s so expensive millions of Americans can’t afford it?
What makes me think our government would do better? I have one word for you: medicare. Better yet, I’m feeling generous so I’ll give you some more: Canada and France. As a matter of fact America is one of the few developed nations if not the only one that doesn’t already have nationalized healthcare.
2. Because the democrats need to toughen up. It’s time for them for them to force a vote which was the original topic of my blog. Reconcilliation.
Ooohhhh, right, right, right. Medicare. That’s the government run system that’s been plagued with projections of insolvency for the last 40 years. Right?
If memory serves, the votes have been forced. Two different versions of the bill were passed and it would seem that the House doesn’t like the Senate version and the Senate doesn’t like the House version.
The only thing reconciliation is going to do is:
1. Water down both versions and give the American people something the polls show that they really don’t want.
2. Give Obama the ability to say that he got UHC passed into law, regardless of how bad it is.
3. Guarantee a trip to the private sector for every elected official who votes for the thing.
Yes, medicare has its problem. And medicare recipients love it.
I take it you missed the Health Care summit, when Brother President cut off the GOP’s gonads and handed them back? And I don’t know which polls you’re looking at. Because the ones I’ve been following show an overwhelming support for HC reform — especially the public option.
No one knows to a certainty whether HC reform will work or not. But we definitely know the current system ain’t working.
Hmmmm. The other day I posted 5-6 links to Zogby and Rasmussen polls which show that American people don’t really want the radical change in this country’s health care system that has been proposed.
They seem to have disappeared.
Yes because this is my blog. It’s one thing to have a discussion (notice I didn’t delete any of those comments) but I’m the only one who gets to post links. Most especially I’m not letting anyone post links to right wing propaganda. But since you insist on referencing them I have to point my readers towards http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3036677/
& http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26315908/
for spirited, factual commentary on health care reform.
Check my blogroll too for Rachel M. & Keith O. on MSNBC
Noted. I’ve been known to filter links on my blog too.
Just for the record, the links I posted were in response to your questions about what polls I’m reading.
As far as the talking heads at MSNBC are concerned, I’ll pass. They tend to be more one sided over there more than anywhere else.
So are you of the opinion that those voting for reconciliation will come out of this unscathed?
No problem. In answer to your query, probably not. But maybe we’ll get what America wants: nationalized health care 🙂
….and if it turns out the either the measure is
A. Outright defeated in the coming weeks
or
B. Passed through reconciliation and subsequently repealed by the next Congress when the electorate throws the incumbency out
are you prepared to concede the fact that the American people do not want nationalized health care?
Think about that one now. If the American people really, really wanted this, it would have cleared last summer. Scott Brown wouldn’t have been elected under the promise that he would be the 41st vote against Obamacare. Congress wouldn’t be ready to change their rules to pass this thing under reconciliation.
Can you show me a recent poll that backs up the fact that we all want this?
Why on earth would I concede? We’re winning.
You want polls? Here you go:
What ABC News/WaPo Poll Doesn’t Address: Is Healthcare Reform Opposition Built On Lies? http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2009/8/21/770332/-What-ABC-News-WaPo-Poll-Doesnt-Address:-Is-Healthcare-Reform-Opposition-Built-On-Lies
Are you really winning? Obamacare has spawned a national movement of people who are upset with Washington because they aren’t listening. Congress is looking to change it’s rules to get it through. Obama is asking members of his own political party to commit political suicide to get it through. Big deals are being made for states like Nebraska and Louisiana to get gun shy Senators on board with it.
If you were really winning, you would have already won by now. Easy as that. The American people don’t want universal healthcare at the cost and intrusiveness that has been proposed.
Go out to your favorite search engine and do a search for healthcare poll results. Look at several different polls. The movement towards the machinations of Washington are quite as strong as what you’re saying.
Did you even watch Rachel Maddow’s video? Do you watch other real news programs such the Ed Show or Keith Olbermann — or even Jon Steward’s the Daily Show? The health care debate and its opposition is not as simple as the GOP would have you believe.
I watched the Maddow video. Did you notice that hollow sound whenever she talks? Why do you think that is? Do you think that maybe it’s a secret message from her sound engineer to the MSNBC viewers at large (both of them) that they know that no one is watching?
The four so-called “untruths” which are featured in that poll have all been proven to be true btw. Go read the bills.
Just because the pundits on CNN, MSNBC, Fox, Comedy Central, or any other network say something is true or false, that doesn’t mean they’re all together accurate. They’re *all* giving you their *own* point of view. Come on Valjeanne. Please tell me you rely on multiple sources of the news in your quest for the truth.
Is your intake of the news limited to the talking heads on MSNBC? Do you really rely on Jon Stewart on *Comedy Central* to get your facts?
Go search this stuff out on other networks and sites and see if it matches up with what you’re seeing on MSNBC. If it does, then maybe everyone wants uhc. If it doesn’t, then maybe there are other factors to consider.
Yes I rely on multiple sources including Democracy NOW, NPR radio, the Huffington Post and a host of other news platforms.
And please don’t insult my intelligence, or those of my readers by directing us to “sites” when you know perfectly well you can find support for “people who enjoy eating cow dung” and any other piece of dribble on the internet.
The facts, as I’ve stated earlier are that millions of Americans are insured and this is driving up health costs. We’re paying for these poor folks anyway, so why not legislate something sensible? The facts are that millions are experiencing what one reporter called: “jaw dropping” insurance rate hikes. And the facts are that people are dying every day because a) their insurance won’t pay for needed treatments or b) they aren’t insured. These are the facts, and I’ve noticed that you haven’t addressed them in any of your posts. Nor the fact that America is one of the few if not the only developed country without national health care.
Let’s just agree to disagree. I’m not going to change your mind, and you d–n for sho’ won’t change mine. I’m a bleeding heart liberal. Loosely translated that means I give a d–n about others’ suffering.
I’m not sure what you mean by directing you or your readers to sites which support coprophilia, as I’ve done no such thing. Yet still, that raises a whole new series of questions. 😉
I have addressed the uninsured. Look at my reply on 02/26.
Yes, there are millions of Americans who are uninsured. We should insure them immediately if the need to do so is there. You appear to agree on that. Yet at the same time, the plan at hand taxes us now and doesn’t extend coverage for another 3 or 4 years. Why didn’t we insure them last year with the stimulus money? When was the last time you had to pay for something several years in advance before taking delivery of the goods or services? When was the last time the government forced you to buy something under penalty of fine or imprisonment? How many uninsured Americans will die between now and the time that universal healthcare kicks in? What makes such a plan any better than what we have now?
As far as sensible legislation is concerned, there are plenty of other means which have been on the table for quite a long time which are not being given any consideration. The reason is because those options don’t give the government enough control over the way things are run.
The whole issue of universal healthcare isn’t really a liberal or a conservative issue. It’s an American issue, and the President has said so himself. If you want to “agree to disagree” on the issue, that’s fine. At the same time, don’t expect those of us against the proposed measure to lie down and take it without a fight.
The stimulus money was used to stave off another Depression (and by the way it was voted for by a number of GOP governors). What President Obama and members of the House and Senate are trying to pass is an overall reform of our Health Insurance System. Two different pieces of legislation. We could have another discussion on what the stimulus was used for, if it was well spent and so on.
When was the last time I was forced to “pay …on threat of fine or imprisonment?” Excuse me? Try not paying your income taxes or insuring your car. When was the last time I was “forced to pay for something several years in advance…?” What do you call our current Health Care system or the preminums paid montly (“in advance”) in case we get sick? And these same Ins. companies can refuse to make good on their “promise:” to pay for medical services in case of injury, illness etc.
As far as reasonable measures which haven’t been used, to quote President Obama why weren’t they brought up before he took office? We’ve been been hashing and re-hashing this issue for a year since he’s been in office. The current bill has been sliced and diced in the name of bi-partisanship. For example, Consersatives like Stupak are trying to use HC reform as a way of restricting women’s right to abortion.
Why so many GOP men have a problem with women’s reproductive rights is a mystery; but that too is another discussion.
Finally you are so right this is an American issue. (Didn’t a 1000 Americans protest for Health Care reform in Washington recently? D–n I was proud of them!) But the ones making the loudest noise and putting up the biggest blockages are conservatives and the Insurance lobbyists they’re in bed with — and they don’t give a rats a** about me or you. This includes the “tea baggers” and the town hall thugs who are being bankrolled and coached by insurance companies as well.
That’s not to say that there aren’t a few democrats riding that gravy train.
I sho’ hope their constitutes vote them right out of office come next election. Peace
1. Fact: The stimulus was supported by assorted GOP governors, however they were not in a position to vote for it.
2. Fact: The stimulus helped unemployment go beyond the promised ceiling of 8%.
3. Fact: There is plenty of stimulus money that sits as unspent.
4. Fact: Income tax is not a tool for forcing someone to buy a good or service.
5. Fact: Laws about auto insurance are at the states’ discretion, and are meant to protect those in auto accidents from financial ruin. If I do not own a car in a state that mandates auto insurance, I am not required to buy it.
6. Fact: If someone wants to access the healthcare system in America right now, they do not have to pay for the treatment four years in advance before benefiting from the service.
7. Fact: Insurance premiums can be paid for in a variety of methods, whether it’s all up front or on a monthly payment plan. A four year waiting period is not required in order to access the system.
8. Fact: Alternative measures have been discussed since at least the Clinton Administration when Hillarycare was being pushed.
Dear Valjeanne,
Chances are your doctor didn’t have time to say much at all.
The sad truth is that most doctors have precious little time to examine, diagnose and meet with you — and even less time to communicate and coordinate with your other doctors and specialists.
And it doesn’t help that medical records are trapped in filing cabinets all over town… except for maybe a few reports you’ve managed to get your hands on.
This breakdown is more than a little frustrating. It’s also costly and dangerous, often resulting in wasted time, duplicative tests, prescription mistakes, and in some cases even death caused by preventable medical errors.
For those with multiple health problems, our current health care system can be a huge challenge.
Consider this: older adults with five or more health problems have an average of 37 doctor visits, see 14 different doctors, and get 50 separate prescriptions each year. They need their doctors to talk to each other and work together as a team.
In the wealthiest nation in the world, it’s just not right that older people — who are often the sickest and most vulnerable — are not getting the health care they need and so often are left to fend for themselves.
Instead, wouldn’t it be great if doctors worked together as a team, medical records were at our fingertips, and patients got the care they needed?
We get it. There is a better way. It’s what the Campaign for Better Care is all about.
We’re glad you’ve joined a growing movement of people who envision a health care system that is more efficient, more affordable, and more focused on patients.
Together, let’s say so long to the status quo.
Sincerely,
Debra L. Ness, President
P.S. Be sure to take the poll. What’s your pet peeve about going to the doctor?
info@nationalpartnership.org